An important news item for everyone in British Columbia !!! Please read and forward to everyone you know!!
Federal Tories put Liberals on hot seat over HST
The Conservative government will introduce legislation requiring Parliament to vote on plans by the Ontario and British Columbia governments to adopt the harmonized sales tax, CTV News has learned
// If the legislation fails to pass, the provincial governments will be unable to pass the HST.The Conservatives support the HST and want the legislation passed by the holiday break. However, the legislation will not be a confidence motion, meaning the government cannot be defeated on the bill.
“(The Conservatives) are saying if it is defeated it will not be revisited, meaning the end of the harmonized sales tax in Ontario and British Columbia,” CTV’s Ottawa Bureau Chief Robert Fife said on Thursday night.
Politically, the move puts the federal Liberals in a difficult position.
If they support the bill, they will face criticism on the left from the NDP.
Help defeat the bill, and the provincial Liberal governments in B.C. and Ontario, may not help their federal counterparts in the next election.
Time to put the pressure on your local MP ! Call, email, whatever -just do it. Here is a link to find your MP contact information by postal code: http://www2.parl.gc.ca/Parlinfo/Compilations/HouseOfCommons/MemberByPostalCode.aspx?Menu=HOC
Westcoast Views with Laila Yuile 
My MP is uber-wingnut Russ Hiebert. 😦 I will call but he’ll probably launch a 30-day prayer assault on me.
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I’ve sent an email off to Hiebert, Harper, Ignatieff, Layton. Enough TAXES !
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Sent to my MP, Keith Martin and Jack Layton. Fingers crossed!
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I think some of you may have your lines crossed here.
Firstly, as a result of constitutional convention, it would be MOST dangerous for the federal govt, no matter of which party it is comprised, to “object” to a decision made by a particular province, unless that initiative was threatening to the unity of the country, for example. Or, if that legislation was something that trampled on the constitution or the general rights of Canadians. In this case, B.C. and Ontario have decided to enact legislation delivering harmonized taxes. In the long run, it will benefit most, although certainly not help the chap sturggle to make ends meet. No matter what you do with him, he’s going to have a hard go of it.
Secondly, objections to the HST must be reasonable. Case in point: To say that it’s a regressive tax, like the Carbon Tax is wrong, because the HST, in large part, as a true consumption tax, will, long-term, aid most and not hurt them. I object to the HST coming down now in a bad economy, yes, for the obvious reasons, but to object to it entirely “because it’s like the Carbon Tax” is demonstrative of ignorance of the difference between the two. The HST is punitive now, the Carbon Tax is punitive–period.
Lastly, think what you will of Hiebert, but The Prime Minister is absolutely doing the right thing by supporting BC and Ontario’s efforts to harmonize, not because those decisions by respective provinces are necessarily right, but because the federal govt should not have the right to step in and over-ride regionalism. It would set a very dangerous precedent.
And from a purely political perspective, the way this is being run by the Tories is a masterful chess move on Ignatieff, who seems to have three different positions on this, at last accounting.
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A G that’s the problem Canada is not a chess board and B C is not a square on the chess board,as we are not to be dealt with as pawns,after all we pay for the games they play,I agree but why cut taxes on corporations,raise taxes on everyone and truly help the economy,why keep strangling the golden goose?If they truly wanted to fix the economy that the big corporations ruined and we bailed out don’t cut their taxes,prices won’t change anyway,bring in the hst.but keep their taxes to,use their taxes for the mess they made,and the taxes we pay for services ,that’s the point games are being played at our expense and we can’t even get in the game,never mind that the rules are made up by them to suit their needs,we can’t even watch let alone play.
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As one of the people this tax will crush, I think it IS a regressive tax, and some of the people it will hurt are children. Children who live in and near poverty, children who depend on a public education. Also, disabled and elderly. I, for one don’t want to live in a society that throws its weak out in the cold.
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AGT sez: regarding the HST
“. In the long run, it will benefit most,”
“the HST, in large part, as a true consumption tax, will, long-term, aid most and not hurt them”
yet he offers no facts to support this utterly false statement. He goes on to basically accuse opponents of the HST of being ignorant – without saying what it may be they are ignoring.
Of course maybe by this “most” that Alex refers to repeatedly, he means the corporate pigs who are already rubbing their hands in glee at the prospect of their greed being even more satisfied.
The capper to me is for him to go on to say “….that it’s a regressive tax, like the Carbon Tax is wrong, because the HST, in large part, as a true consumption tax, will, long-term, aid most and not hurt them.” makes me wonder if he knows the meaning of the word regressive in relation to taxes. Consumption taxes ARE generally regressive, ESPECIALLY when they are applied to necessities such as shelter, clothing and food – things that everyone needs no matter how weatlthy they are. The necessities of life are a small part of the overall expenditures of the rich, but consume the bulk of the budget (or more) of the poor which is why they are regressive.
A rich man can forego a new boat to avoid a luxury tax, but the only way to avoid a tax on food (and not just directly on the food at check-out) or shelter, or medical needs (ie the HST?GST hit on pain-killers and other drugs) is to either do without or steal!
I like Alex’s style, but perhaps he should spend an hour or two a day with a dictionary, because he seems to use words at random, is it just for their sound?
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Hes right about the feds meddling in the provinces goings on.
Check the overall message and forget about the finer definitions.
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the feds meddling?Does that bother you?I couldn’t care less,I hope they vote on it and bring down this hst,The only reason it bother some people is because if that happens ,gordos done for real,and I say yeah!
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Okay, sorry if I was not clear. Beneddetto get it. The point here is not splitting hairs like my pal koot. You cannot have the feds telling the provinces what to do. Do I like the HST, no, I’ve said that several times. but in the long run the streamlining of HST will make it easier not just for the fat cats that koot rails against, but for the small business owner too. Look it up and don’t let your (our) legitimate disdain for Premier Grotto colour your objectivity. I think it’s a terrible thing to be doing now (by the province) but in the long run, and in a better economy it will make a negligible difference. My greater point is the one about keeping Ottawa out of our business. Quebec has been doing that with merit for years. Why should we be different?
As for consumption taxes being regressive…this is absurd. If I choose to buy a twenty dollar bottle of wine and someone else buys one at $100, then we pay proportionately. Fair dinkum as the Aussies say.
The HST is bad policy and an across the board grab, yes, but the blame must rest at Campbell’s feet, not Harper’s.
Think about this: What if we one day decide something as a province that we all like, and the govt says no. What will you say?
Here’s what they’ll say: When you didn’t want the HST, we stepped in not because you didn’t want it, but because we didn’t want you to have it. Tough luck.
Think…
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It is ironic that Alex always accuses me of hairspiltting (which as Alex himself admits is a weird term for him to resort to) when I ask him to either use words correctly or support his sweeping judgemental statements which do little more than shout his opinion with facts.
As far as the argument re: the feds stepping into provincial affairs over the HST – it is a federal matter at least partly to begin with as it is a matter of the province “harmonizing” their own sales tax with the existing (and questionable and regressive) federal sales or value added sales tax so it is on its face a combined federal-provincial issue from the get go.
It reminds me of the “states rights” ongoing debate to the south which was so successfully used for decades to support segregation.
But without even considering such jurisdictional issues it is simply another cash grab and income re-distribution scam by a desparate bunch of thieves that headquarter their gang in Victoria.
It is part of an ongoing scheme to relieve the corporate pigs of yet another burden. In my next life I don’t want to be a human, I want to be a corporation – they have all the rights and privileges of a person with NONE of the responsibilties and they are rapidly shedding themselves of any tax burden as well.
As I’ve mentioned before the richest 5% of greed bags who already own 95% of the wealth will not be satisfied until they also own the remaining 5%.
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Alex insists on ignoring all of the people in this province who can’t afford to eat now, never mind the bottle of wine. If my hydro and telephone bills rise, there will be NO money for food, GET IT!
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“If my hydro and telephone bills rise, there will be NO money for food, GET IT!”
Sorry for your bad situation, but if that is really the case, unless you earn your meager living from the computer internet, perhaps that luxury should be the first to go.
Couple of sites that may be helpful:
http://www.essortment.com/all/grocerybudget_rqcg.htm
http://www.essortment.com/all/highspeedinter_tupf.htm
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Sorry to hear about that Kim,I’m not quite in your predicament,and I’m sure Alex is puffing away on his 25 dollar cigars,and swilling 85 dollars a bottle brandy,and has no clue what life is like for you,I for one am concerned at the direction things are going we are already paying for services,that are being cut and paying more through fees,and on the other hand people that can afford to pay are having there taxes cut ,our taxes will go up and services will continue to be cut so I don’t see alex’s reasoning behind his comments ,things are being said like we need this money for services,so stop the corporate tax cuts and stop taxing people that have to buy services and products from these corporations,how the hell can we buy your products if were paying it in taxes for sweet f ### all.
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In lieu $100. grog and $25. cigars why not indulge in a PST, GST, tax free joint.
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Again, the point is lost on you…
The notion that this is a “federal” issue is nonsense. It’s genesis was Victoria.
Set aside Mr. Harper…you honestly, any of you, expect me to believe that any of Messers Duceppe, Igantieff or Layton would care about the poor of those those with hydro bills hanging over them like the sword of Damocles?
If you streamline the two taxes, the group it makes it easiest for are exactly those plaintive: Small businesses that are more likely to employ the average jane, will lower costs, not advance them, and if they’re fair, of course, pass those off to consumers and employees. Lowering costs has as effective a trickle down effect and raising them.
As for my personal tastes, let me assure you…when I was flat broke about a dozen and half years ago, no one handed me anything to get back up. Not one cent. I make no apologies for the wine I quaff or the cigars I smoke. But, believe me, you never forget the taste of your own blood on your teeth…frankly, we live a relatively moderate life, thanks very much.
Don’t forget, too, that I worked on the DTES for many years. I’ve seen destitution first-hand. It’s why I fight so hard against the povertarians and grief pimps that feed off the downtrodden.
Kim, I’m most sorry about your predicament. I do not mean to offend you. Simply put, the facts are what they are. The HST, in principle, is not a bad thing, it’s just the timing. And, there’s no question, B.C. could forego this and realize efficiencies in other ways.
But then, do you not think Colin Hansen has already spent our $7 billion federal allotment?
It’s a problem, no question.
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Internet should be the first to go, but I can’t bear to lose it. Ask anyone here, it’s all we have left in honest debate and reliable information. I have started a veggie garden and am thinking about taking the buck who visits regularly. Thanks for the links Sal on budgetting for food, I could pretty much write the book on that! Fortunately, I have a background in food service and horticulture. Its pretty hard to shop sales when your food budget amounts to one or two trips a month, they never seem to happen at the end of the month, when disability pensions are paid out.
Alex, I don’t begrudge you your brandy and cigar, but you don’t convince me that the HST will not hurt significant numbers of people in this province while being a boon to large corporations. That is fundamentally wrong. And yes, Hansen has probably spent it on a retractable roof and all the other wonderful stimulous ideas of his Masters. It is, indeed, a problem.
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Once again Alex the Great makes it up as he goes along with:
“The notion that this is a “federal” issue is nonsense. It’s genesis was Victoria. ”
The fact that it is happening NOW, is Victoria, and it was done totally underhandedly – denying before the election that it was even being considered and then imposing it as soon as they had a new mandate, but then whenever the lips of Gordo and his henchmen move lies are being told.
Howeve IT WAS THE FEDS who originally came up with the idea of harmonization – perhaps as a sop to the cash strapped provinces who have suffered from declining transfer payments for years while their residents send ever more bucks to Ottawa, for what – oh yeah, partly so Harpo can pretend he is a WAR leader!
Why invest in education, health care or public safety when you can just run around the world shooting people and feeling big time!
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